SPEAKER_01 0:00

What it do, what it do. It's your boy Andre Spruel and you're tapping into Middle of the Fence podcast. Today's episode is a real one. I'm joined by Sarah Rose, creator of BPD Beautiful, author of Stadie's Favorite, and vocalist slash bassist for the band Them Versus Her. We're diving into her journey navigating borderline personality disorder and overcoming it, growing up around toxic relationship dynamics, and how generational trauma and different forms of abuse can shape how we become and how we can break those cycles. This is another reminder that no matter what side of the fence you grew up on, we're all more alike than we think. Let's get into it.

SPEAKER_02 0:51

What it do, what it do? It's your boy Andre Spruel, and you are tuning in to Middle of the Fence Podcast. Thank you so much for taking time out of your day. Whether you're listening, watching, or both, as I like to say, time is the most valuable thing on this earth because we can spend it, we can't make it back. So as always, thank you for your time. And today we have a special guest with us today. Uh please welcome to today's episode, Sarah Rose. Sarah, thank you so much for taking time to be on the show.

SPEAKER_04 1:20

Hi, thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_02 1:22

Of course, of course. And before we get into the interview portion, uh just want to give a quick background uh on Sarah here. So we've got a guest whose story literally defines what life is like being on the middle of the fence. Growing up in an affluent Long Island suburb and dealing with instability at home, financial struggles, and the kind of family dynamics that shape how you see love, relationships, and yourself. From navigating mental health and being diagnosed with BPD to becoming a mother at 19 and turning her experiences into purpose through her platform, her book, and her music. This is a journey built on faith, resilience, and growth. How does that intro sound?

SPEAKER_04 2:12

Sounded great.

SPEAKER_02 2:13

Awesome. Awesome, awesome. And um, you know, uh with that intro uh alone, we're gonna be getting into uh some heavy topics. So um before we get into the heaviness of it and the seriousness, we're gonna have fun along the way, obviously. But you just got married recently, so congratulations.

SPEAKER_00 2:36

How was that? Are you are like are like do you finally are you just like happy to just finally just get everything over with that?

SPEAKER_04 2:43

Yeah, kind of. Um well we didn't take long to plan. We planned for about a month, but we were engaged for about a year and a half, so okay.

SPEAKER_01 2:53

Awesome.

SPEAKER_04 2:54

Yeah, it was a stress, it was a stressful month.

SPEAKER_02 2:56

So I'm sure of it. I'm sure of it. I have um I have friends that recently got married and some that are getting married soon. And uh I always hear like their stories about how stressed that they get and uh and all that with all like the wedding planning and and all that stuff. So glad to hear that that wasn't necessarily as much of a you know problem for yourself.

SPEAKER_04 3:20

So it was fun. Yeah, I'm glad it's over. Now we now we just have married life, and that's that's the fun of it.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

That's it, that's it. All right, so uh if you're ready, we can we can start getting into the uh interview portion.

SPEAKER_03 3:35

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_02 3:36

All right, all right. So uh like I mentioned, uh you grew up in a affluent acres type of environment out in Long Island. And um also too, uh life at home was difficult to say the least, uh, when it when it when it came to growing up with your with your with your parents. So do you mind just delving in uh a little more into uh your parents uh and the role that they played in your upbringing and um how that ultimately led to the discovery of BPD for you?

SPEAKER_04 4:17

Yeah. Um I witnessed a lot of toxic relationship dynamics growing up. Um I think my parents tried their hardest, but they they didn't know as much as we know now. Um I think a lot of people back in the 90s and even further, and even more recently, they just kind of believe that like abuse is just something that's physical. Um, but meanwhile, you know, we have a lot of emotional abuse, verbal abuse, mental abuse, and the list goes on. Um so I saw a lot of like emotional abuse, a lot of uh, a lot of fighting.

SPEAKER_02 4:53

Um and would you say that like yeah, and during like you know, like when you were witnessing all of that around like what what age range uh do you like like uh remember all that type of stuff?

SPEAKER_04 5:06

Um one of my first memories was of a fight between my parents and they my dad left and I was hiding under a bed with a knife like inches from my face. I was I must have been like three. I was under my mom's bed and uh she thought she thought someone was breaking in, but really it was just my dad uh had sent a friend over to deliver uh pizza. He ordered pizza for us. So I think he was trying to get back on our good side, and uh she thought someone was breaking in. My mom had uh back then she was she had her own emotional issues. I think we all did, we just didn't know like have any names for them, and um, you know, so she tended to go with the extreme case scenario, and that impacted me. Um, but even before my generation, my mom dealt with a lot as well. So it's just kind of, and then before that, my grandmother did. So I think it's just like a generational thing. And it got a little bit better every generation, but it was still very bad. Um and uh I think in this generation now we're just learning so much about like cluster B personality traits and and how so many families seem to be impacted by them. And uh they tend to just kind of roll over to the next generation. So now that we're kind of learning about it as a whole on the internet, I think you know, we're seeing a lot of cases where people are like stopping that generational abuse, but we still have a lot of awareness to spread. So that's kind of what I why I do what I do.

SPEAKER_02 6:43

Yeah, and you know, thank you for sharing that, you know, and that's the imagery from that from that story is very, very powerful, you know. It literally sounds like a scene out of like uh out of like a movie or a TV show, you know what I mean? But it's like you know, that just highlights the show that that's a reality for some people. And when you gave your answer, the one thing that uh I like just instantly thought of was the generational trauma because you mentioned how your mom experienced it to a certain extent, your grandmother as as well. We're gonna we're gonna talk about grandma soon uh as well. Um and uh, you know, because that's that's how you know the generational trauma portion shows up differently for everybody. And for my family dynamic, um, a lot of it also derived from the toxic tree and way of thinking. You know what I mean? Uh it just showed up in a different way where it's like uh instead of coming to a realistic or just resolution, like in general, it's like um we're gonna butt heads and argue, and I literally will hold on to my story. This fan member will hold on to their story and literally will go years holding on to those grudges without talking and speaking to one another. You know what I mean? Yeah, like that's literally how it goes. But now we have so much like resources and information out there, just like how you mentioned. So it's like for this generation and moving forward, it's we have more tools to first of all to first off realize what's going on and what's happening, and then second, to actually do something about it. Because I think that that's another thing too, where the previous generations talking about their feelings was just never a thing.

SPEAKER_04 8:44

Never they didn't go to therapy, they didn't now like everyone and their mom is in therapy, like we it's just so normal. Like it's something we don't think anything of it, which I think is a great thing. It's definitely one way that society has improved over the years.

SPEAKER_02 8:59

A hundred percent, a hundred percent. And you also uh grew up with brothers as well. So do you mind just uh giving a little uh background um on your relationship with them as well?

SPEAKER_04 9:13

Yeah, um, well, my older brother and I grew up together. He's only four and a half years older than me. So we had all those childhood memories. My little brother came into the picture when I was almost 13, and he lives with uh his mother. And, you know, he would go to my father's a couple of times a week, and I would go to my, you know, once my parents got divorced. Uh so I would see him, you know, like twice a week from the time I was 12, 13, all the way till, you know, I was older and I wasn't really going to stay with my dad. I was just going to visit for dinner and stuff. So I would see him. Um, but believe it or not, I'm actually closest with my little brother.

SPEAKER_03 9:57

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 9:58

My older my older brother moved away and he hasn't like come back in like six years, and we all miss him. We're all like telling him to come home. But uh he's got his own issues to work at until he can come back. And uh, you know, I miss him. My little brother, uh you know, he he just moved away recently as well. So I'm the only one still here, and that's kind of sad. Um, but I I love them. It was it was a little harder because I always kind of saw my brother as like more of a the golden child growing up, and I was more of the scapegoat. Um but over the years I think that dynamic has changed where I became the golden child and then he was kind of scapegoated, and believe it or not, um this is rare, but I think my parents have done a lot of healing over the years, so now all of our relationships are just generally healthier, which is I think is amazing. Um but that's normally not the case. Uh I don't know what caused that. I think probably over like the last five or so years we've we've all been kind of changed, uh which is great, but it it's not normal.

SPEAKER_02 11:10

No, but I'm I'm really glad to hear that. And I had something very similar actually, uh happened with me as well, Sarah, where uh I grew up multi-generational home, uh typical like Latin type of home, like growing up, you know. So yeah, like grandma, grandpa, aunt, uncle, cousin, mom, siblings, right? So I I was always used to like just having a large family and just growing up with that. And then as I progressed through my um uh adult life and started to come into my own and enter my own growth and evolution uh phase, uh some of those family members were no longer in alignment with where I was and with where I was heading. And obviously, I'm sure you can relate to that as well. And so there's there was years where I didn't speak to certain to certain family members, and as recently as this past weekend at the time of recording, uh I actually got to hang out with some of my family members that I haven't like actually hung out or spoken to in uh quite quite some time to start to begin that healing journey because what happens is everyone uh like has to go through their own phase of growth and evolution, obviously. And sometimes it really does take time, and then for you to sit back and realize like, oh my gosh, like if I keep going at this rate, I'm not gonna have a relationship with my children or my sibling or whatever the case may be. So I think that that's part of it too, where now that the previous generation, although they didn't have the tools that we do now, uh they're starting to realize, okay, just because we didn't have it and we're older now, you know, like no like no shade to anyone that you know falls into that category, obviously. But it's like, you know, they're starting to realize, okay, it's not too late, and I can use these tools as well to help me.

SPEAKER_04 13:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:22

And and and I think that that's really, really cool to see as well, definitely.

SPEAKER_04 13:28

Yes, definitely like what's happening, I think, is um, you know, I started my platform and I I hid it from everyone for years. And then about two years ago, I I revealed my face and my name, and I told everyone in my life about it because I was like living two lives for a while. And uh I don't know, I think that's also helped too that they you know they can see that and they see the impact of it. So I think it's you know, no, yeah, it's been cool. Yeah to see.

SPEAKER_02 14:00

No, yeah, definitely. And honestly, we could just segue into that now and then also just delve into your story um uh a little more. So you're referring to uh starting uh BPD beautiful. Uh yes, yeah. So uh just for so for those tuning in, uh just let them know what BPD is because we've mentioned it multiple times, so some people probably don't know what it is. So um if you could just give a little background on that and then um how it came to be and you know, and the fact that it's impacting uh so many people uh as well with it. So I definitely want to commend you for your work. I did check it out prior prior to the interview, so you know really, really good stuff, seriously.

SPEAKER_04 14:44

Thank you. Um well, BPD is something I started in 2019, uh about six months after I was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder. Uh I originally started it as like a personal blog just to kind of document my own treatment process with BPD and using a DBT dialectical behavior therapy. And then over like two years, I I progressed in a way that I was actually able to reach remission. And um I kind of just from there morphed it into like a self-help recovery hub. Like we have like videos with like you know, guided mindfulness exercises, we have blogs from me and from other people at BPD and like therapists and psychiatrists who like submit their guest posts. Uh we have like we correct um like different resources, worksheets. I have my book that I publish through through it. So it's it's just kind of like a it's a hub that people who are impacted by BPD can visit and kind of find some hope, whether they have the condition or whether they're a loved one.

SPEAKER_01 16:03

That's awesome. That that that that's really uh awesome stuff right there.

SPEAKER_02 16:08

And um when it comes to BPD, uh it's something that I was aware of, but you know, it's something that I feel like is said or people joke around a lot about it, I feel like, where it's like, oh, you know, I I feel like I just have like multiple like personalities, you know. Like I know I know I know people close to me that joke about it, but you know, for most for people that are actually diagnosed with it, it's you know, it's something that is actually pretty serious, you know what I mean? So um would for anyone that you know isn't too aware of it, um, are there any like early signs that you can have it and then you know if and if there's like different, you know like severity levels of it, would you say?

SPEAKER_04 17:07

Yeah. Um well it does, yeah, it they it does run on the spectrum. So you have people who will have traits but they don't really like have the condition or you know they do, it's just a mild form. They they're pretty like they call it like high functional BPD or high functioning BPD. Then there's people who are on the opposite side of that, on the other side of the spectrum, and they're they're very uh they're not doing too well. They probably have uh suicidal thoughts often. They uh they might not be able to work, they might have to get disability. The uh, you know, it so it does vary. Um, you know, some people have a lot of self-awareness and they can, you know, hold themselves accountable, even though it doesn't, you know, it triggers that shame that they tend to get. Um but then there's also people with BPD who have absolutely no self-awareness, and those people can be uh sometimes they can you can end up being very abusive without even meaning to um the signs and symptoms are usually one of the big ones is the fear of abandonment, a very intense fear of abandonment. Um it's more than just like an anxious attachment style. It's you know, you kind of put your whole identity into one person. We uh in the community, we call that like a favorite person. Uh a lot of you'll see a lot of like all or nothing thinking, black and white thinking, where they they'll split on you. They call it like splitting, where um a person with BPD, usually with their favorite person, but this can be with anything, with their with their own identity, with their school program or their job or anything. Um they'll either see it as like all good or all bad. So if like they get upset with you, they'll talk in extremes, like, oh, you always do this, you never do that. Or um when they're idealizing you and they're on the other end of that, they'll, you know, you're the best thing that's ever happened to me. I I can't, I wouldn't be able to live without you, like very intense, like dramatic statements that kind of flip back and forth. And you can split like within minutes or days, or I mean the longest I ever saw or did was probably months, but usually it was a lot quicker than that. Like throughout the day, my feelings and opinions would so quickly go back and forth. Those are like the two biggest symptoms, but you also have um shame. You tend to have very intense, all-consuming shame, especially after like an episode. Um there's uh you can dissociate often. Usually people with BPD also hurt themselves a lot. They'll like when they get triggered, they're kind of like not always, but a lot of the times, their first instinct will just be, well, I'm just gonna end it. You know, they there's like no, there's no middle ground. Um rage, you'll see rage like during triggers, they get very angry. Of course, these are symptoms. There's nine total symptoms. Um, they they usually have a very bad shifting identity. So like with the splitting, it also corresponds with their identity. So they'll either love something about themselves and then hate it, or they might change their hair color a lot, or they're always trying different hobbies. They in my experience, I tend to or I tended to, I don't have a favorite person anymore. Um, I have a husband, but he's not my favorite person, which is amazing. How are you gonna feel about about giving that? It's very it's a healthy thing. Um I actually have a healthy relationship now. But with a favorite person, a person with BPD will tend to like put their whole identity into that person, which so like for me, I used to like, even though I didn't like something, I would like make myself like it because they liked it, and then I would just completely change my identity for them. Like I would change how I dressed, how I spoke, or my political beliefs or anything, my opinions. So it's not a very healthy dynamic. And uh so those are some of the common symptoms.

SPEAKER_02 21:14

I think I'm forgetting like one or two, but no, I mean you definitely covered a lot, like right there. And it sounds like it's definitely heightened in a romantic relationship type of setting. Yeah, which makes sense because you know, most of us have been in a romantic relationship, so it's like it's your emotions and trauma and all that paired with someone else's at the end of the day, you know. So it's like you're so that in and of itself is gonna have you feeling and thinking all over the place. And then if you are someone that is battling BPD as well, uh, I feel like it, I I can understand, you know, why um you know in those types of types of settings it's you know it's it's heightened even more you know yeah um so and and this is this is something that uh affects people regardless of the environment that you grew up regardless of whatever it is that you've had to navigate in your life this is this is something that you know people either you know people personally deal with or we know people that deal with it you know like and it's very closer and they're and they're and they're closer to us than we think. And I feel like a lot of people may not have it diagnosed because of just like all of the different you know stages of it just like how you how you mentioned. But I I'm just I'm just so interested by this like literally after this like I'm just like I like I just want to keep doing uh even even more research into it you know and um when so when when would you say that like at what age were you actually diagnosed with it and then when it when it came to actually start to want to you know make the changes to get better with it uh how you know what what would you say in regard to that well I got formally diagnosed in 2019 like right around 2019 right when I was like kind of like six months later I launched BPD Beautiful so I usually will say BPD Beautiful was created in 2019 or 2020 and it's kind of halfway through that year mark um but I got diagnosed with that I was 28 years old and it was it was 2019.

SPEAKER_04 23:47

However it took a long time for them to find it because I kind of bounced from like a therapist who didn't think I had BPD because I was so eager to want help and I was I was a good client according to her and she said people with BPD don't change. She had a very warped idea of what BPD really was. Um again she I like I mentioned before it's on a spectrum so she didn't really see that because a lot of like the stigma people just assume that oh if you have BPD it's like there's no help hope for you. It's not the case.

SPEAKER_02 24:20

Yeah I mean like I'm figuring that out I mean this is going to sound so ignorant but I I feel like people's way of thinking is okay they have borderline personality disorder they're crazy leave them alone like I like I yeah I just unfortunately you're right that is true.

SPEAKER_04 24:35

A lot of people will assume that and it's because you know they run into people who have like traits and yeah it get you really can look I this I hope I don't offend anyone but you really can look pretty pretty bad shit when you when you have untreated BPD and you're and you're very far into the exp into the spectrum and I'm saying that from someone who's been there myself I I was uh kind of known as a like oh she's intense she's unstable she's yeah um I did a lot of things in my past that you know made people want to stay away from me because I I wasn't taking care of myself and you know I was just very clingy and or I was very moody because you have very intense mood swings.

SPEAKER_03 25:20

Right.

SPEAKER_04 25:20

Um and uh I mean so I got diagnosed though in 2019 I was I was in my you know later 20s but I started showing symptoms when I was as young as 11. So and I've heard that's very common that uh you know people will look back and be like yeah I showed symptoms around my preteen years but most psychiatrists most professionals are reluctant to diagnose someone under 18 with BPD because that when you're a teenager I mean all of our emotions tend to be a little extreme.

SPEAKER_02 25:52

True true so so they kind of want to wait until you're grown to see if it's you know if that's what it is by um sorry he's my husband's leaving um so so um we yeah I mean I was probably 11 that was like on it that was like when I first did uh self-harm and trying to like censor myself I know we're not supposed to say those words anymore but uh yeah so really 11 was was uh yeah that was when I first started noticing it and I I was always worried about getting left behind or left feeling left out from like my friends and I was like realizing like other people don't act like this but yeah your your your story is very in inspiring so let me just let me just say that now you know I mean um that that's just like the general takeaway that I'm having right now and part of or uh a major factor that helped you that helped you you know uh to be where you're at now is uh one of the lessons that you learned growing up which is to go with the flow and trust God. Yes. That's something that has been my biggest lesson of 2026 because uh with my personality type I like to be in control of things and so I've operated most of my life like that. And here and there it's like okay I'll let God take the wheel here but I'm gonna get right back on on the uh driver's side and move from the passenger side. You know what I mean? So that's so that's something that has been or is my primary lesson for uh 2026 is truly uh going with the flow and trusting God and you know just showing up as the best version of myself uh each and every day. But for you that was uh a major lesson and helped you navigate um all of the things that you've gone through to be where you're at now. So uh just elaborate for the middle of the fancy family a little more for that um honestly it's probably a lesson I learned this year as well.

SPEAKER_04 28:12

I mean I I always knew I'm like I'm a bit of a control freak I have trouble just like letting things happen. I mean even this week I was a little I was stressing out and I'm like I'm not I'm not taking my own advice um so it is a continuous lesson that I have to that I have to try because you know life is scary we we live in the unknown and we don't know what's gonna happen and especially in today's day and age 100% like we can't even trust what we watch now like everything there's so much deception so it's really hard and and I you know even though I thought for years that I was like submitting to God I was real like I realized I'm like no I'm still trying to operate from my own plans and my own understanding you can relate to that so hard it's it's a it's a continuous learning lesson but if I could tell my younger self something that's what it would be like yo it's okay this is all gonna work out like just wait all this pain that you feel right now it's gonna have some purpose in the end. Um and I know some people don't like to hear that but that's how I like to deal with my own past and I choose to make it into a learning lesson because if I don't then my heart's just gonna get really bitter and I'm just gonna be angry and I don't I'm trying not to be angry anymore.

SPEAKER_02 29:36

Yeah and and just operating from that from that from that type of space for the rest of your life it it it takes a lot of energy to operate from that from that type of space in a negative way um and and yeah you know it it really is a continuous learning experience when it comes to that and just like how you said certain things happen where in the moment we try so hard to rationalize and and make sense of why something is happening to us but then eventually in due time it shows itself and reveals oh you know what God you really have me there because you know like a couple years later or a couple months later whatever the case like may be like it makes sense why I had to go through that. You know what I mean? And everyone has their own version of that for sure. And when it comes to navigating any difficulties in our lives we obviously can't do it alone even though at times we think we can uh so one of the one of the uh one of your biggest role models was your grandmother uh so she immigrated from Bogota Colombia and had six children when she six children six children when she came here uh speaking of previous like generations it's it's I find it funny like to hear like you know where it's like oh yeah we had like I have like six six siblings and or like nine and you know like literally my my grandfather on my dad's side of the family literally had like ten brothers and sisters or something like that.

SPEAKER_04 31:14

So you know so it is you don't really see that no you have one or two or maybe three.

SPEAKER_02 31:21

Exactly exactly but she played so your grandmother uh played a a major role uh in your life so uh just uh what what was like was is there one memory that you can really pinpoint that encapsulates the type of role that she had in your life or is it just more so um just everything that she brought to the brought to the table and literally it had and it had like an effect on every single aspect of your life.

SPEAKER_04 31:53

I hope that that made sense yeah yeah um I mean it wasn't just one memory I like like she this was actually my mother on my father's side um my other grandmother had a very difficult life um as well um I do believe that her trauma kind of took over her um more so but that's another story for another day with my my father's mother she she lost her husband about four years after immigrating here and she had all these children she barely spoke the language she had to work to support them and you know this was back in the in the 60s when women just you know we weren't seen as equal as as much as we are today and uh she had to teach herself how to drive and um I mean one of my one of my most vivid memories of her when I was younger is I had to do a like a family interview kind of thing with like someone who meant a lot to me and I chose my grandmother and she had so many grandchildren because my aunts and uncles also had big families so there was just so many of us we had a huge like my dad's side even my mom's side both sides of the family are huge because I tried it my mom also had all these siblings so yeah I mean it's it's times were different you know times are definitely different they were um and uh you know so on my on my dad's side though you know she she had so many grandchildren so like she babysat me when I was little but like we weren't super close like she didn't live with us we all lived very scattered um we really only sold each other for holidays so even though I have that like Colombian side to me we have that Colombian family we're all very Americanized uh sadly which I wish we weren't because I think it would have been nice to be like more in touch with those roots but it is what it is. Uh but yeah I mean I did a family interview with her and I remember being on the phone with her and it was kind of I used to be intimidated to talk to her because she her accent was thick. So I was always afraid that I wouldn't understand her. And I was probably like eight nine and I remember asking her these questions she was like telling me them I was writing her answers down and and um at the time I didn't really understand because you know I was only like eight or nine I didn't understand how big how significant what she did was I was like okay her husband died she had all these kids cool end of story but then when I became a mother I was like I I thought about it like when my son was older and I was you know I was struggling because having a child especially with untreated mental illness is just not easy. Um but I remember thinking like wow how did she do this like because I I had you know my my first husband and I did get divorced and but I still had him like he he was always been involved with my son. So like my son splits up the week with us. We have 50-50 custody I still had his support you know like but I just couldn't imagine like doing it on my own and then with six children and then in a in a foreign language like in a foreign country where you're just learning like the language you're and she started like teaching um I think she taught English to like like Spanish students. She taught something and she worked in the hospital and like a in the cafeteria.

SPEAKER_02 35:20

So she had all these like you know she was working hard and doing what she could to support her family and I don't know it's uh I don't know I it I think that's very admirable like I don't know how she did it but I'm thankful that she did no yeah and you know I also uh you know my my mom uh immigrated from Argentina to this country and so when she moved here she was only like four years old so um you know so she was very very young same as my dad oh okay well so yes so she was very very young but uh my my grandparents primarily my grandfather he was the primary reason for the family coming here and when you have that aspect of family that immigrated from a different country uh sometimes it makes you realize like oh wow what I'm going through in the hurdles that I've had to jump through is nothing compared to the shit that they had to go through.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 36:29

Like you know like for most people having to move to a different country where you don't know the language and just having to create a life out of basically nothing with whatever you have whenever you come over here you know it just like I feel like it makes you grateful especially as you get older like how you mentioned because when you're eight nine years old I mean you're a kid you're worrying about you know toys and you know like I don't know like cartoons and and stuff like that. Yeah I was right I was worried about myself. I wasn't thinking about exactly exactly but but but as you get older it does give you a high level of gratitude for the sacrifices that the family made uh just to make just to take that leap of faith in the in the first place and ultimately you know help help you know create memories and and like the family history that will go on from generations as a result of them making that move. Like because my grandfather moving from Argentina he's the only one that moved from there. His other seven siblings stayed in Argentina and those generations of family are still out there. So he literally was the only one to move and you know it makes me think yeah it makes me think like oh my gosh life would have been totally different like this conversation wouldn't even be happening like you know I mean I know I mean I don't I don't know who I would be if I would even be alive but like my my grandmother's family did they they kind of shunned her for it they're like what are you doing come back home like why would you stay she's like no my kids will have a better life out here I need to stay and she stayed yeah so shout out to the grandparents that made the leap of that took the leap of faith didn't listen to their to their to their family and you know it's led to amazing uh results because of that yeah so it's the land of opportunity absolutely absolutely so to transition a little bit um one thing that you know I I I definitely wanted to talk about is the fact that your upbringing was shaped by mental health and the types of relationships that you sought and those were also factors that helped led to you create to creating BPD Beautiful and as well as your novel Sadie's favorite uh so uh just give us uh a little more background on that if you don't mind.

SPEAKER_04 39:00

Yeah um well like I said I had the untreated BPD uh and that meant I had a lot of toxic turbulent relationships with you know romantic partners I got married uh divorced also my friendships were generally very toxic and turbulent my relationship with my parents um yeah as a as a side note I think my you know both my parents dealt with these cluster B traits and I think that's because my father grew up without his father that's that's an abandonment wound even though it's not intentional it's it's still a trauma. But I mean all of that kind of gave me not the sturdiest of foundations so my relationships generally were very toxic um and once I actually was finally diagnosed I mean it took like eight years of therapy for a therapist to see like hey this sounds like BPD and then I had it double checked by a psychiatrist and that's who gave me the diagnosis. But I had all that experience kind of led me to once I launched BPD Beautiful I started writing a book and I was gonna write it I was just gonna write a memoir. And then you know over like two years into like kind of just writing scenes here and there um I went through like a major life change and um I went through remission around the same time. So I was just like you know I need some separation from this I kind of want to just get into like that creative writing headspace because writing I'm also a singer a songwriter um writing has just always been such a therapeutic outlet for me. So I fictionalized everything and I started adding parts and I got really creative with it and then uh I found it to be very therapeutic but my main goal with it was to kind of just show the people who deal are impacted by BPD like kind of show them like the effects and dangers of these favorite person relationships and like how the character main character Sadie helped she got she overcame them it goes into like her faith journey and how her faith got strengthened and um you know I mean it shows her when like before she's diagnosed and untreated and then it shows her years later when she's like a completely different person. And it kind of just the story just bridges the gap between like how she came from where she is now and uh I was hoping by writing it I would inspire some people and you know see what happens.

SPEAKER_02 41:51

I like that like that's that's I literally just can't say enough great great things. And another thought that I had was uh the environment that you grew up in. So you grew up in uh a a more affluent neighborhood in the Long Island New York area but you weren't exactly living life like most of your peers let's say so you know did did that look like so did that look like you know while they're chilling for the summer like let's say you're having to work and all that and you know like what are what were some of the you know what was life like navigating that difference you know because you already had you already had to navigate so much with what was going on in your personal life and now it's like sprinkling you know the affluent long Long Island kids on top of that so how was how was that experience like for you?

SPEAKER_04 42:56

You know I always felt inferior to everyone I always felt like an outcast like I was just kind of like an alien amongst normal people. I didn't notice too much of the gap growing up it was more so like the older I got the more I realized like oh wow okay these people had a lot more than what I had um but I always I did I I used to get like jealous like I would see um you know kids who like they were the overachievers and they uh used to get all these like great grades and the teachers liked them and they focused and they didn't have like all these mental issues and they seem to have good families. Whereas like my family and I were you know my mom and I were just screaming at each other in here and I haven't spoken for two days and I'm like over in my room locked in my room harming myself and she's forcing me out and taking me to the hospital. Like so there's always like a jealousy um you know I mean we we were still very blessed though. Say that you know, we might people have it much worse. Um, you know, there were some times when we didn't have our electricity on or our hot water wasn't on. Um, I've been I didn't have like a cell phone, yeah. Like I didn't have a cell phone until I was older, and then when I did get one, I I paid for it myself. Um they like I was never told, like, oh, you need a job to help with bills, but like I knew like, well, I need a job because I don't have any money. So, like, you know, I got a job and I saved up some money, and um, you know, I was in a car accident when I was like three, so I had a little sediment that came in. It wasn't much, but back then it was a lot because I was 18 and I had this nice little sum of money, and I was like, Oh, I'm gonna go get my first apartment. Um, I didn't go to college because they told me how much it was. It was gonna be like this is probably cheap now, but it was like 40 to 60,000 for the year. And I'm like, I can't afford that. Um that's probably considered cheap now, which is insane.

SPEAKER_02 45:00

Yeah, I don't even, yeah, I don't even want to know what the tuition prices is these days.

SPEAKER_04 45:04

I don't know either. I'm guessing it's like six figures for the year if you want to go to like one of those, you know, fancy colleges at least.

SPEAKER_02 45:12

And probably like 70 on like the low end, like 70k or something like that.

SPEAKER_04 45:17

Like, because this wasn't even like one of those like fancy schools where it's like, oh, it takes forever, like it you have to have such great, great grades to get in. Like it was one of those, like, oh, we'll just accept you, you know. I'm like, so I opted not to go to college, which I'm happy for because I don't think it was part of the plan, and uh that was just something I thought I wanted. But um, yeah, I mean I did I did kind of notice it, but like I think it was my my mental health is really what like got to me. It's just like I just compared myself to so many people. I had so many insecurities, I was constantly up and down with my moods, I was so attached and cling like clingy, and people don't like that word in the community. Like people with BPD, they they find it offensive. It's just like when describing myself though, like it's really the only word I can use describe myself because that's how I was. I was constantly like following my favorite person around, and um yeah, I think it was really my mental health that really got to me. But like looking back, it I do see a difference. You know, some of my friends were like from the same neighborhood as me, and others, you know, they had these big mansions and their their houses were beautiful, and my house was like older and much smaller, and you know, we had all these cats, and you know, it wasn't as clean. We didn't have like a cleaner coming in, and you know, like there was a lot of things.

SPEAKER_02 46:48

Yeah, just like the yeah, like that, yeah, like that, like that typical type of stuff that that you see in those like affluent uh type of type of areas. Definitely, definitely. And uh just want to ask you uh one more question uh before we uh wrap things up here. So the word to best describe your journey is unlikely. So why so why that word? Uh yeah, so why that word unlikely to describe your journey?

SPEAKER_04 47:22

I think because given my childhood and like the generational trauma that's an impacted my family, it was unlikely for me to be someone who could have a healthy relationship. It was unlikely for me to raise a child who instead of fighting with me, he's fifty, he's almost 16 now, instead of fighting with me and having all these really traumatic arguments, and he's like hurting himself or he's suicidal or he's running away, like kind of like what I did at his age. We actually have a very close relationship, and um, it's unlikely. And it's unlikely that someone like me who had no job prospects, no motivation in life, horrible grades, I got like all Ds. I nearly failed high school, I had to go to summer school. I, you know, I was just really bad at math, and I was called the slacker, I was called lazy. I had teachers tell me, like, oh, well, where are you gonna go in life? You know, like I was like one of those kids, and it's unlikely now that I would be where I am, which is very amazing. I I'm very blessed. I don't even want to state everything because I feel like I'm bragging. It's just like it's unlikely. And um yeah, it's it's cool to to see how when we when I tried so hard to do my own plan, it it wasn't working out for me. And then when I finally surrendered more and more to the process of life and a God, I my whole life turned around and I'm now living a life that I only I used to dream about.

SPEAKER_02 49:04

So Mic drop, mic drop. No, that was now that's a that's a that's a that's a beautiful way to capture your journey and all that you've overcome, and you know, obviously wishing you nothing but the best ahead as you continue in your in your journey, of course, of course. So uh where can people tap in with you, support your work, and follow what's next? This is your time to shout out your social media and and uh anything else you want to uh give a shout to.

SPEAKER_04 49:37

Well, you can always find me on bpdbeautiful.com. You can find all of our content. We have a video page, we have Sadie's favorite linked there. Uh we have our blog, we have our social media pages linked there where we have like little easy to digest recovery tips. We have like checklists, lists, different. We try to be as unique as possible, we try to be practical with our content so things are easy to follow and it's not just too overwhelming because you know recovery is uh it's an uphill battle, but it's totally possible, it's totally worth it. You can also go to SadiesFavorite.com just to see my uh see the book. One thing is uh my band, Vem Versailles and I also produced a origin an original soundtrack for the novel.

SPEAKER_02 50:28

So that's awesome. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_04 50:30

Yeah, the novel features characters who play music, so the soundtrack kind of plays into that.

SPEAKER_02 50:36

It kind of um we played like their style of music, and you're a vocalist and bassist for the band. Yes.

SPEAKER_04 50:44

Yeah, so and that's fun. And you can find me there at them vs her, them vsr her dot com. Uh you can also you can find me on Facebook. I don't really go on social media as much anymore. I'm like, I'm so tired of it. It's just such a rat race. Um, but we do post on BPD Beautiful's handles. We post uh bpdbeautiful.blog on Instagram, we're on Pinterest, YouTube, it's not our biggest platform. Um, threads, you know, we're on all of them. Just look up BPD Beautiful, you'll see our our turquoise logo with the uh description and comments as well.

SPEAKER_02 51:21

So we got you. We got you.

SPEAKER_04 51:24

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 51:25

Of course, of course. And Sarah, thank you so much for your time uh and for sharing your powerful story and all that you've overcome. Uh, you've definitely in inspired me with it, so I know that you uh have and continue to inspire others with your story as well. And this is another reminder that no matter what side of the fence you grew up on, we're all more alike than we think.

SPEAKER_03 51:52

Thank you again.

SPEAKER_02 51:54

Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_03 51:55

Of course.

SPEAKER_02 51:57

Thank you so much for tuning in to this episode. If this episode resonated with you, go ahead and follow the podcast so you stay tapped in and show some love with that five-star rating. It really goes a long way so we can continue reaching more people just like yourself. And if you want to see these conversations, pull up on YouTube and check out Middle of the Fence. Appreciate you for tuning in. Time is the most valuable thing we got.